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Same-sex marriage foes far outnumber proponents at dueling Whitley courthouse rallies Wednesday
Posted On 08 Jul 2015
Above, Whitley County Clerk Kay Schwartz addresses a crowd of about 300 supporters outside the Whitley County Courthouse Wednesday.
The turnout was lopsided Wednesday morning as two competing groups gathered outside the Whitley County Courthouse to either support or protest Whitley County Clerk Kay Schwartz’s decision not to order new marriage license forms that could be issued to same-sex couples wishing to marry.
About 15 people turned out for the Whitley County Marriage Equality Rally to protest Schwartz’s actions compared to about 300 that turned out at a rally supporting her.
After the rally, Schwartz said that she was absolutely overwhelmed and overjoyed by the turnout.
"I am so thankful to God that people are taking a stand for what is right and what they believe in," she added.
The two rallies took differing approaches.
The rally supporting Schwartz involved various speakers, many of whom were ministers, addressing the crowd in what at times resembled a church service, complete with the singing of Amazing Grace.
They spoke from a podium on the steps of the courthouse. As other supporters held up various signs saying among other things: "We support Kay. U may have been chose for such as time as this" and "Why did God destroy Sodom and Gomorrah?"
By contrast, the marriage equality supporters marched around the courthouse periodically carrying signs with various messages, including: "Gay people pay taxes too" and "Human rights are not optional."
Their effort lasted until about 3 p.m. with varying numbers of people taking part.
Even though there were dueling rallies at the courthouse, the two rallies peacefully co-existed.
Interactions between the two groups were mostly civil and few though.
"To willing enter into a sinful lifestyle is a lot different than falling on your knees and praying to God for forgiveness for an act of adultery. To willingly enter into a lifestyle knowing it goes against God that is considered an abomination," Schwartz supporter Joe Kelly told one marriage equality demonstrator holding a sign, who didn’t address his comments back.
Another Schwartz supporter, Norman Bledsoe, told protesters as they went by that he knows they have a right to demonstrate and while he was against what they stood for and the gay lifestyle he supported their right to be out there protesting.
"We believe that Jesus is the way to heaven but we respect you and your freedom to walk around here and hold up banner," Bledsoe told protester Cameron Hatfield. "We may not agree with you but we love you because your God’s children just like we are."
Hatfield responded that he loved him too and the two shook hands before Hatfield started marching again.
Rally support Schwartz
"We are here today in support of Kay Schwartz, a good Christian lady," said Mt. Ash Baptist Church Billy Carpenter, who was master of ceremonies for the rally supporting Schwartz. "We support the right she stands for and her rights that she ought to be able to stand with."
Carpenter noted that the rally brought supporters from different counties to support Schwartz’s cause.
Several people spoke at the rally supporting Schwartz, including several ministers and Casey County Clerk Casey Davis, who has refused to issue any marriage licenses since the U.S. Supreme Court ruling legalizing gay marriage on June 26.
"God bless America," Davis told the crowd. "I am in awe at how much love there is today and how much support that there is for something that seemingly our nation has said we are all wrong about. I am not willing to sit down and say they are right."
Davis said just because one group has received rights that it hadn’t received before doesn’t mean Christians should lose their rights, including his and Schwartz’s rights to do their jobs without violating their beliefs.
Davis said that he was glad Tuesday night to hear House Speaker Greg Stumbo issue a call for Governor Steve Beshear to convene a special session to address the issuance of gay marriage licenses and laws and regulations surrounding that issue.
"I am so glad to know that people from both sides of the aisle, Republican and Democrat, understand that it is not a party thing. It is something that involves all of us," Davis noted.
Davis admits that he was disappointed later Tuesday evening to hear Beshear announce that he wouldn’t be calling a special session to address the issue.
Davis and other leaders are planning to meet with Beshear in Frankfort Thursday over the issue, and he asked the audience to pray that Beshear’s mind is changed about the issue of a special session.
"I owe it to my country and my God to fight for what we need to keep," Davis added.
Schwartz is going to Frankfort Thursday in support of Davis’ meeting with Beshear but won’t actually be attending the meeting itself.
Williamsburg Green Street Church of God Pastor Steve Kirkland said he didn’t believe that the rally was about protesting an issue but rather to support an issue, Christian leadership in the government and Christian values.
"Everybody can be against something but it is time for God’s people to get together and be for something," Kirkland said.
Kirkland said he is for a government that doesn’t force him to be a Christian, but he is also for a government whose leaders are Christians.
"That is up to you and I to make sure those type of things happen. We will see you at the polls," Kirkland noted.
David Carr, an official with King of Kings radio station in Somerset, noted that there are clerks on both sides the political aisles, who feel strongly about the issue and have taken a stand against issuing gay marriage licenses, including like Schwartz and Casey Davis, who are Republicans, and Rowan County Clerk Kim Davis, who is a Democrat. Kim Davis is being sued in federal court for her refusal to issue any marriage licenses.
"This is not a Democratic issue or Republican issue. This is an American issue," Carr said.
Carr said the greatest thing God has given to us was eternal life and the second greatest thing was life itself.
"I believe the third greatest thing God has given to man that is a tremendous gift is not another man but a woman," Carr said to the delight of the crowd.
Carr said that Christians don’t bash and cuss out people but they do stand together for what they believe.
"We are here today to stand with one another and for Kay and Casey and Kim," he added. "If we don’t stand together, we are going to stand by ourselves."
Jeff Fugate, pastor of Clay’s Mill Baptist Church in Lexington, told the crowd that religious freedom has been under attack for 50 years, such as taking the Bible and prayer out of schools.
"Lawsuits are filed against the primary and basic activity of Christians," Fugate said. "We have seen in the last 50 years government not only not stand for Christian values and religious liberties but they have gotten involved themselves in the business of sin and vice, such as the promotion of gambling."
Now the Supreme Court is promoting same sex marriage, he said.
The government can’t force people to have an abortion or drink alcohol or gamble, but Fugate said the government is trying to force people to take part in something that is against a deeply held religious belief.
"We are here today to ask the governor to stand for the First Amendment right of our county clerks and the First Amendment rights of all Kentuckians," Fugate said.
Schwartz addressed the crowd briefly towards the close of the rally.
"My heart is totally overwhelmed by you standing up for the First Amendment," Schwartz told the crowd. "I believe in Jesus Christ. I will stand on the word of God as is my right as a Christian. I love you. I appreciate you today. I thank you for coming."
The rally supporting Schwartz lasted about 45 minutes although many in the crowd lingered on the courthouse lawn socializing for another 45 minutes or so.
Marriage equality rally
Alyssa Monhollen, who was one of the organizers of the marriage equality rally, said she was happy she organized the rally despite the relatively small turnout by like-minded supporters.
Hatfield said he came out to Wednesday’s event because "love doesn’t have a gender."
"Everybody needs to love and let love,’ Hatfield said. "If they are going to stifle that love then I think we have a right to be out here protesting just like everybody else."
Hatfield said he was happy with everyone, who turned out to support his cause, and wasn’t disappointed the numbers weren’t larger.
"If this is all we can muster then I am sure we are all pretty happy with that," he added.
Corbin resident Amber Knight said she attended the marriage equality rally because she is gay and deserves the same rights as everybody else to get married.
"I don’t think any official should defy the national law to say that I don’t deserve it," Knight said. "This isn’t about religion. This is about love."
Tale of two fathers
The fathers of two people, who helped organized Wednesday’s marriage equality rally, also turned out at the courthouse Wednesday morning but for opposite reasons.
Ronald Canada, a local minister whose son, Trenton Canada, helped organize the marriage equality rally, attended the rally supporting Schwartz Wednesday morning.
"I stand strongly 100 percent against the homosexual movement and against gay rights," Canada added. "I told my son when he went that route that he choose a route of destruction and all the people that are going that route, it is an abomination in the sight of God. God stands against it."
By contrast, Rodney Monhollen came out Wednesday to stand with his daughter, Alyssa Monhollen, at the marriage equality rally.
"I believe that Kay Schwartz has the right to her religious convictions and I support her in that," Rodney Monhollen said. "I also support that you can’t take your religious convictions and force them on others.
"In other words, if my employer decides he doesn’t want to support the gay community and homosexuality, he can’t discriminate against me. Why should she (Schwartz) have the ability to discriminate? You can’t just pick and choose the people you are going to attend to."
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Gay rights activists complain that society’s refusal to accept them as they are and to okay their sexual activities, is the only thing that stops them from being happy. But this is a foolish falsehood. Within the “gay community”, the murder rate is high, The murder rate is 15 times higher among homosexuals than heterosexuals and even in “gay enclaves” like Provincetown, Massachusetts where there is no societal disapproval at all the rates for depression, suicide are among the highest in the Nation. Since homosexuals have greater numbers of partners and breakups, compared with heterosexuals, and since longterm gay male relationships are rarely monagamous, it is hardly surprising if suicide attempts are proportionally greater, drug abuse, etc. are much higher than normal.
Homosexuality is not a normal way of being.
This is a fact just ask a homosexual!
“God” does not hate the homosexual just the act.
This is a case dealing with the separation of church and state. We live in a society that has decided we will not be governed by religion. When someone takes a government job they take on the task of enforcing the law of the county, state, and country. No one is forcing them to take the job, no one is forcing them to do anything. They can quit at any time if their personal opinion interferes with their ability to do the job. But they are not charged with deciding what policies they want to enforce or not. If this person wants to make a statement, make it and resign. Simple.
Kay Schwartz Shame on you for not doing your job!!
MARY// NO I AM NOT ATHEIST THEY DO NOT BELEAVE IN ANYTHING. I AM AGNOSTIC LOOK IT UP LOVE COMES IN MANY DIFFRENT FORMS THERE IS NO DIFFRANCE IN LOVE JUST PEOPLE WHO JUDGE AND LET ME SAY THIS I HAVE SEVRAL PEOPLE IN MY FAMILY THAT ARE PASTORS AND THEY DO NOT SHOW ME DISRESPECT OR ANGERY OR TRY TO PREAACH AT ME LIKE YOU DO PEOPLE BUT ITS PEOPLELIKE YOU THAT MAKE EVERYONE DISLIKE CHRISTIANS
Really. in other words you are a atheist
Really, in others words you are a atheist,?
they don,t believe in God. No I do not believe in your fairy tales, they are not Biblical . I believe in God who sent his Son to take our sins to the cross and died for them. That is Love. When you look out and see all the beauty God made when he formed this World I do not see how anyone could not believe. God is love but if you do not except him and be saved you will find out there is also a hell for unbelievers.As my last statement on this is God Bless you all !!!!!!! Good Bye
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I agree with Kay Schwartz. No one should have to do anything at their job that they disagree with. That is just common sense.
( MARY ) I BELEAVE IN THINGS THAT CAN BE PROVEN TO ME…. SO YU BELEAVE IN THE TOOTH FAIRY??? SANTA?? …..THE BOOGY MAN…
MY POINT IS NOT EVERYONE HS THE SAME GOD OR BELIEFS BUT EVERYONE BELEAVES IN SOMETHING. THAT BEING SAID I AM ALL FOR PEOPLE TO BELEAVE IN WHAT THEY WANT BUT DO NOT criticize ANYONE FOR HOW THEY FEEL OR WHAT THEY BELEAVE. IF IT DOESNT AFFECT YOU OR YOUR FAMILY THEM EVERYONE NEEDS TO KEEP OUT OF OTHERS BUSINESS. ITS JUST LIKE AT ONE TIME IT WAS TABOO FOR BLACKS AND WHITES TO DATE NOW IT IS COMMEN.
When two men are fighting and the wife of one of them intervenes to drag her husband clear of his opponent, if she puts out her hand and catches hold of the man by his privates, you must cut off her hand and show her no mercy.
12. Deut. 25:11
Hey Really, Looks like you do not believe in God or the Bible. Well both are real. One day we will all stand before God to be judged. to the believers who have been saved and tried their best to do his will he will welcome home. To the unbelievers he will say, Depart from me I never knew you. Yes there is a Heaven and a hell. With your spelling I can not read part of your post,s. I pray you and other who do not believe will turn to God before its to late. God Bless America Again.
TO JUST ME…. IT IS NOT A preference I DONT KNOW WHERE YU GET THAT FROM DO YOU PREFER TO BE STRIAGHT??? WAS IT A CHOICE FOR YOU?? HHMM IT IS JUST LIKE ITS NOT A CHOICE FOR GAYS OR LESBIANS.. I WAS BORN THIS WAS I DONT THINK I CHOSE IN 3RD GRADE TO BE A LESBIAN…. I DIDNT EVEN KNOW WHAT IT WAS THEN THAT I WAS FEELING SO DONT SET THERE ON YOU HIGH AND MIGHTY CHAIR AND SAY ITS A preference!!! AND YES I AM STILL TALKING BECAUSE YOU THINK THAT YOUR WAY OF THINKING IS THE ONLY RIGHT WAY OR THAT EVERYONE SHOULD THINK LIKE YOU… HOW CAN YOU SET THERE AND SAY GOD THIS AND GOD THAT BLA BLA BLA… HOW CAN YOU BELEAVE IN SOMETHING THAT IS MAN MADE AND PROBEY HAS BEEN CHANGED OVER SO MANY YEARS.. THER EIS NO PROOF OF GOD THERE IS NO PROOF OF THE DEVIL FOR ALL WE KNOW THEY ARE URBAN LEGENDS MADE UP TO SCARE PEOPLE.. IF YOU WERE THERE WHEN “GOD” MADE THE BIBLE THEN PROOV IT TO ME.. OTHER WISE SHUT UP ABOUT WHAT YOUR GOD SAYS BECAUSE FOR ALL I KNOW YOUR GOD IS A HAND PUPPET YU KEEP IN YOUR CLOSET OH WAIT THATS YOUR SKELETONS…….
Helen, good points. Yes God is love and we are to love one another, At times you see some one that its very hard to love. We started on a downward path when Bibles and Prayer was taken from the schools and our Flag that so many gave some and a lot gave all for is under attract also. If you go to a VA hospital and sit in the waiting area a while it would break your heart to see the shape some of out Veterans are in.
Really, you are still screaming. Yes I am a child of God and I am not judging anyone. That is Gods department. I do not hate the sinners, just their ways. If the same sex are allowed to marry God does not recognize it, it is a abomination in His site. I believe I would vomit if I saw a man kissing a man, or a woman another woman. God did not make men gay or woman lizzies, if thats their sick preference its them who has to answer to God. There is only one sin God will not forgive man of, Blaspheming . In the end I sure would hate to hear Him say, depart from Me I never knew you.
The greatest commandment which God gave to us is love for our neighbors, and also, even love for our enemies. Love is the principal thing. I am sure all of the ones on here who claim to be Christians are very sincere in their beliefs, and they are certainly entitled to them. But, let us show forth God’s love toward all of His creatures, human and animal, on this earth…and we are everyone of us God’s creatures. Let us not make God sound like a hateful devil. God is love…I believe this with all of my heart. And, I am very glad that the LGBT community has equal rights now to marry if they so choose. By the way, I am a 64 year old heterosexual woman.
Kentucky has 120 Countys and as of this morning about half of the clerks are not going to issue same sex licensee. I am proud of our clerk for taking a stand. She is one of Gods children and to do something against Gods will would be wrong. If our Governor don,t step in and do something hes going to have a big bunch of clerks to replace. God be with you all even the ones who do not believe
Even if you’re very religious you can’t think being gay is worse than being a career criminal or murderer. Spend your time on people who actually harm others, I’m a biologist and won’t believe in homosexuality until it’s proven scientifically. But that doesn’t make me hate these people.
Sry not trying to spark the whole gay choice debate I’m just trying to show even someone who doesn’t believe still has compassion. Live and let live what are these marriages going to do to affect your life?
Really, first of all stop screaming,that is rude.
All you have done is slam around about the Bible.. I believe Gods word and He is against this same sex crap. God is the judge ,I am not.
SO CITIZEN THE KJV OF THE BIBLE HASNT BEEN CHANGED?? WERE YOU THERE WHEN IT WAS CREATED?? WERE YOU THERE FOR EVERY COPY THAT HAS BEEN MADE AND READ EACH ONE?? I DONT THINK SO! IT COMES DOWN TO THIS PEOPLE NEED TO MIND THIER OWN BUISNESS. IF IT DOESNT HAVE ANYTHING TO DO WITH YOU THEN DONT PUT YUOUR NOSE IN IT!!! WORRY ABOUT YOUR OWN LIFE NOT EVERYONE ELSES!
Tim you showed your ignorance. in a lot of your statements, shame on you. Read King James version of the Bible, it has not been changed. Anyone can call them selves a christian but unless you been born again and are a child of God you are not saved. A child of God is against this same sex stuff and we have to take a stand for what we believe . If more people turned to God America would not be in the shape shes in now. We will all stand before God one day and be judged.
I’m so proud of the few that did show up on the side of love today. I wish I could’ve been there and I had plans to but other things came up. Kay needs to step down if her religion is getting in the way of her government duty.
Tim, I appreciate your support and entire comment. Well said.
Stick with the KJV of the Bible, its still the same.
If this is not stopped No one at the Court House or any Preacher in Whitley County should marry a same sex marriage. Abomination against Gods law . man man- woman woman stupid stupid
I wanted to submit a video as an illustration of the language that is being used today to deny the rights of the LGBT community. Search youtube for “Preacher Phil Snider gives interesting gay rights speech” Please watch the entire clip. I promise it is a very powerful video.
Tim, you are absolutely correct. “Yeah NO” – don’t kid yourself, there were a LOT of people claiming the fight for civil rights was a religious issue, and there were a lot of “religious” people claiming that equal rights for all people regardless of race was wrong. We are seeing the same language being used to attempt to persecute another group of human beings who deserve the same guarantee of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness as any American. I commend all of the citizens who stood up for the rights of those who are being persecuted today. Kay Schwartz can have her opinion, but she should resign immediately if she cannot uphold the law.
Tim, that’s a BAD comparison. One has religious backing and one doesn’t. Shame on your ignorance.
I’m old enough to remember that this anti-gay behavior is the same kind of behavior we saw from people who didn’t agree with African Americans getting equal rights during the Civil Rights period. Same car, different garage.
Rather than waste all that taxpayer money on defending the Religious Freedom Restoration Act in various lawsuits that are sure to pop up, why don’t Christians just edit out or ignore the anti-gay sentiment in the bible and all their troubles will go away? It’s not as if the bible hasn’t been edited lots of times before. Get rid of the anti-gay bias in the big book and no one, and I mean no one, will have anything negative to say about Christianity again.
Anti-gay prejudice is a cancer in Christianity and a thorn in most of our sides (I am a Christian. I’m also straight). We’ll ignore a church’s teaching about divorce (and get divorced), ignore a church’s teachings on birth control (and kill unborn babies), forget about eating foods the Bible says we shouldn’t (because most of us forget everything anyone tells us about food and get merrily obese), we can forget about how the bible supports slavery – it’s all there in the book – but so many Christians won’t let go of their anti-gay prejudice. And that’s what the defenders of gay marriage and gay rights always see…
…the sheer, galling hypocrisy.
So what happens if this tug of war makes it to the Supreme Court? Logic dictates that SCOTUS can’t show animus toward one group only. The Court can’t rule for only Christians being allowed to exercise their religious freedom over gays – any person of any religion will be able to pick and chose customers if that shop owner or clerk objects to something because of their “sincerely held religious beliefs”. ANY religion. If SCOTUS were to rule that religious rights trump a citizen’s right to be treated equally under the eyes of the law, how soon might an Islamic shop owner, for example, refuse to serve a woman, because he thinks the woman doesn’t “dress according to what the Quran says she should dress”?
What about a Jewish guy standing in line to buy a bagel and the Christian baker says to him, “The Jews killed Jesus. I don’t want to serve you”.
Do you see where I’m going with this? The fun is just about to begin. And in the end it will have very little to do with gay marriage.
Meanwhile, to see this Schwartz woman up on the steps of the court, refusing to follow the Supreme Court’s verdict, is just like watching good old Governor Wallace try to block the school house doors from admitting African-American students. Times change but one thing always remains the same: there is no one more self righteous than a bigot.